General Football Chat #3

Started by Dixkot, September 16, 2012, 18:43:31 pm

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DavidL

June 11, 2021, 09:30:20 am #1185 Last Edit: June 11, 2021, 09:34:23 am by DavidL
Quote from: Slim on June 10, 2021, 12:22:49 pmThe Telegraph has a useful guide to countries taking part in the Euros and their attitude to "taking the knee":

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/euro-2021/2021/06/07/divided-nationsthe-24-teams-euros-attitudes-taking-knee-gesture/
Only a quarter of the teams likely to indulge in the divisive gesture then. I think that will make Gareth Southgate look a bit silly with his attitude....good!
If there was a European Championship of self-flagellation, England would win by a mile

Slim

Sad though it is, I feel it's important that England's participation in this tournament is as brief as possible, to minimise the oxygen of publicity and bring forward the happy day when Southgate is out of that job. He's a dogmatic and arrogant man, and I hate that.

A pundit on Times Radio made an excellent point yesterday morning. These clowns aren't merely grovelling on their knees for fashionable anti-social gestures like dismantling capitalism and defunding the police, they're libelling and denigrating white society. Given the number of ethnic minority and mixed race players in the team, there's arguably a racist connotation to all this.

Let's kick racism out of football.

dom

Quote from: Slim on June 11, 2021, 11:22:04 amSad though it is, I feel it's important that England's participation in this tournament is as brief as possible, to minimise the oxygen of publicity and bring forward the happy day when Southgate is out of that job. He's a dogmatic and arrogant man, and I hate that.

A pundit on Times Radio made an excellent point yesterday morning. These clowns aren't merely grovelling on their knees for fashionable anti-social gestures like dismantling capitalism and defunding the police, they're libelling and denigrating white society. Given the number of ethnic minority and mixed race players in the team, there's arguably a racist connotation to all this.

Let's kick racism out of football.
You'll need to ask them their motives, just as for those that choose not to take the knee, but I doubt there's a single footballer who's interested in dismantling capitalism or defunding the police. (more's the pity, it would lead to more interesting post match interviews!)  It's clear that the team and Southgate have put a lot of thought into continuing the campaign and are doing it for valid reasons.
 
Looking at football itself, the diversity of the team is something to be commended but it's not reflected at a wider management level or among the higher echelons of football.

Anyway I'll be supporting all knee taking teams for the tournament.  Interesting that it's many of the countries who have an even worse issue with racism than the UK are not taking the knee
When the truth offends we lie and lie until we can longer remember it is even there. But it is still there. Every lie we tell incurs a debt to the truth. Sooner or later, that debt is repaid

Slim

Quote from: dom on June 11, 2021, 13:13:21 pmYou'll need to ask them their motives, just as for those that choose not to take the knee, but I doubt there's a single footballer who's interested in dismantling capitalism or defunding the police. (more's the pity, it would lead to more interesting post match interviews!)  It's clear that the team and Southgate have put a lot of thought into continuing the campaign and are doing it for valid reasons.
 

It's naive at best, petulant and arrogant at a more realistic worst.

You may be right about the motives or you may not, but those who assert that the association between this loathsome knee gesture and the Marxist sociopaths of the BLM is anything but indelible are either very ignorant or maliciously dishonest.

Likewise, to pretend that it hasn't become political at this stage is downright comical.

This very conversation shows how divisive it is. We'd never be having this argument about Kick It Out, would we?

dom

Quote from: Slim on June 11, 2021, 14:37:36 pmIt's naive at best, petulant and arrogant at a more realistic worst.

You may be right about the motives or you may not, but those who assert that the association between this loathsome knee gesture and the Marxist sociopaths of the BLM is anything but indelible are either very ignorant or maliciously dishonest.

Likewise, to pretend that it hasn't become political at this stage is downright comical.

This very conversation shows how divisive it is. We'd never be having this argument about Kick It Out, would we?
Kick it out and Red Card were/are pretty passive in comparison.  This is really bringing the issue front and centre and maybe it's a good thing that divisions are being brought to the surface.  It may enable genuine debate and discussion and lead to solutions
When the truth offends we lie and lie until we can longer remember it is even there. But it is still there. Every lie we tell incurs a debt to the truth. Sooner or later, that debt is repaid

dom

When the truth offends we lie and lie until we can longer remember it is even there. But it is still there. Every lie we tell incurs a debt to the truth. Sooner or later, that debt is repaid

pdw1

Quote from: Slim on June 11, 2021, 11:22:04 amSad though it is, I feel it's important that England's participation in this tournament is as brief as possible, to minimise the oxygen of publicity and bring forward the happy day when Southgate is out of that job. He's a dogmatic and arrogant man, and I hate that.

A pundit on Times Radio made an excellent point yesterday morning. These clowns aren't merely grovelling on their knees for fashionable anti-social gestures like dismantling capitalism and defunding the police, they're libelling and denigrating white society. Given the number of ethnic minority and mixed race players in the team, there's arguably a racist connotation to all this.

Let's kick racism out of football.
Talk about the kettle calling the pot black  ::)
Better drowned than duffers if not duffers wont drown

Slim

Quote from: pdw1 on June 11, 2021, 19:53:42 pmTalk about the kettle calling the pot black  ::)
Dogmatic and arrogant I hope you mean, not racist. I would accept the former assessment with some regret, but the latter is patently untrue.

Slim

Quote from: dom on June 11, 2021, 14:49:30 pmKick it out and Red Card were/are pretty passive in comparison.  This is really bringing the issue front and centre and maybe it's a good thing that divisions are being brought to the surface.  It may enable genuine debate and discussion and lead to solutions

Come on, you know very well that it's been counter-productive and divisive. No-one could deny that.

DavidL

We were struggling to get ourselves sorted for watching the footy on Sunday at a pub in Whitby but happened on a pub called The Windmill at Stainsacre on the ride back to our site. It's about half a mile away and has a nice big screen in the bar and will be showing the game. So, table booked for lunch and had choice of table.....sorted!

Matt2112

June 12, 2021, 01:16:14 am #1195 Last Edit: June 12, 2021, 01:19:14 am by Matt2112
Quote from: dom on June 11, 2021, 14:49:30 pmKick it out and Red Card were/are pretty passive in comparison.  This is really bringing the issue front and centre and maybe it's a good thing that divisions are being brought to the surface.  It may enable genuine debate and discussion and lead to solutions
"Passive in comparison"? This suggests BTK is positively militant.

Kick It Out, Red Card and similar high profile campaigns have been a part of the fabric of "elite" football and beyond for a good - and productive - 30 years; there will not be a football fan who isn't aware of their function.  And rightly so.

The rationale behind BTK stems from a terrible incident that, as the most high profile court case so far this century demonstrated, had no apparent element of aggravated racial malice whatsoever.  It's a gesture tainted with a previously freely-admitted and enthusiastically endorsed association with the BLM "movement" of which "progressives" have since washed their hands and have now decided on an interpretation that makes them look more virtuous, and anyone who applies even the mildest honest critical scrutiny perceived as vile, spuming bigots. 

In short: it isn't helping.  Just ask Wilfried Zaha, amongst others.
The keys to happiness

zoony

It would be nice to see some general football chat in this thread, as it is titled. Sick to the back teeth of all this political bollocks about taking the knee, it does my head in, and needs a separate thread if people want to bang on about it.

Decent display by Italy in the end last night against a disappointing Turkey side. Got me in the mood for the tournament now, although I doubt I will watch 3 games a day all the way through.

zoony

Terrible and worrying scenes with Christian Eriksson last night, and thank god he is now on the road to recovery. It was good to see that they managed to complete the game as well, as I don't know how it would have affected the tournament otherwise?

Matt2112

Quote from: zoony on June 13, 2021, 14:44:14 pmTerrible and worrying scenes with Christian Eriksson last night, and thank god he is now on the road to recovery. It was good to see that they managed to complete the game as well, as I don't know how it would have affected the tournament otherwise?
I fell asleep during this game (more tiredness than anything else) and awoke to see disconcerting shots of a clearly distressed crowd and the Danish players as they formed their "shield", so it took a few moments (and an internet search) before I realised what was actually going on.

Even knowing the outcome and watching - perhaps inadvisedly - the incident on YouTube, it was profoundly harrowing and left me in bits. The overwhelming feelings though were of gratitude and relief at the actions of the medical staff who undoubtedly saved Eriksen's life.

All thanks should go to them.
The keys to happiness

zoony

All the hype about The Scots qualifying for a major tournament for the first time in 23 years. Nice to see that they haven't changed then 😄.