General Election 2019

Started by DavidL, October 30, 2019, 07:58:46 am

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Slim

Quote from: döm on October 31, 2019, 10:12:24 amShameful...This is Tory Britain.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/oct/30/food-banks-childrens-books-britain-hungry-election

And that's a left-wing propaganda newspaper, reporting a left-wing propaganda book. Literally nothing of interest to see.

Slim

So - another General Election again already, but a much-needed one. Like last time, the stakes could not be higher - with the threat of the most extreme, hard-left, fanatical and controlling statist version of the Labour Party there has ever been hanging over our heads, once again.

But I'm not overly concerned. They ran a very effective campaign last time, albeit largely based on buying votes with other peoples' money. And they faced an inept Tory leader. Yet they still lost.

This time round they have the added handicap of openly alienating large swathes of their traditional support, especially in the north, by campaigning on the basis that they'll offer a second referendum then campaign to remain in the EU. Unless something absolutely astonishing happens, which admittedly I would never rule out, Labour cannot hope to win a majority and they should do worse than last time. We are very unlikely to have to witness the spectacle of the Marxist, anti-semite IRA sympathiser who told us that Venezuela's government had a "better way of doing things" entering Number 10.

But politics is very volatile at the moment.

I'm a natural optimist and I believe in the human spirit, and the capacity of our society to organise in the interest of everyone without the jackboot of the state pushed into our faces. I know that you can't make poor people better off by demonising and punishing wealth creators. I know that socialism is in the end, only envy and resentment dressed as a political philosophy.

And I certainly don't want to see an extremist government taking hold of the press and the education system to push its own backward ideology. So even without the Brexit factor, I would be casting a vote for liberty and hope by lending my support to the Conservatives.

I think it highly unlikely that there'll be a formal electoral pact between the two democratic parties of the centre - I suspect that the Conservative Party sees this as a bit below its dignity, which is a shame. But I also know that Nigel Farage is a wily and clever operator who will not risk the result of the referendum that he fought for valiantly, for 25 years.

It's unthinkable that the Brexit Party would stand a candidate against my own MP Andrew Bridgen, who has fought his country's corner with great honour and determination, so I don't really have a dilemma there.

Nïckslïkk2112

Quote from: döm on October 31, 2019, 10:12:24 amShameful...This is Tory Britain.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/oct/30/food-banks-childrens-books-britain-hungry-election
Quote from: undefinedWhen they reach the food bank, the child tucks into biscuits and squash while her mother sags like a balloon from which the air has escaped.
More like the mother is inflated like a balloon from all the junk food she hoovers up day in day out.

If there's so much food poverty out there how come there are so many porkers out there? Especially those working in the NHS; shortage of funding? Shortage of funding my arse.

Quote from: undefinedTheir children get neither sweets nor treats, and their parents can't afford to take them to Colchester zoo or the fireworks
And these things are necessary?

The shameful thing is that too many people expect too much and offer little in return. Bring back the workhouse, give people board and lodgings in exchange for a bit of work.

FWIW I was born in the Workhouse.
Legend in my own Mind


Slim

Food banks are largely there to feed people who prefer to spend their money on cigarettes, Sky Sports, beer and Bet 365.

döm

Quote from: Slim on October 31, 2019, 12:28:44 pmFood banks are largely there to feed people who prefer to spend their money on cigarettes, Sky Sports, beer and Bet 365.
Any empirical evidence of this? 

And keep calling the current guise of the Tory party and the Brexit party "centrist". Someone may believe you eventually!
You can check out any time you like but you can never leave!

zoony

Nothing is going to change in my constituency, Ludlow, which is always a safe Tory seat seat. I'm far from being a Tory myself, but with Corbyn and Abbott running Labour, they are just unelectable, along with the Lib dems, now run by the odious Swinson who has no regard for any of the 17.4m who voted to leave the EU. I don't mind The Brexit party, but they just can't win can they? I know he's got his faults, as they all have, but at least he has shown full commitment into leaving the EU, which I fully agree with.

Slim

Quote from: döm on October 31, 2019, 13:27:28 pmAny empirical evidence of this?

Unfortunately I don't have any empirical evidence to support my observation. However - it's interesting to me that the number of food banks is now casually used as a sort of easy substitute for poverty statistics, and I think that's a convenience for people hoping to make a point.

Here's a more meaningful measure:



Poverty statistics are easily misused unfortunately because the definition is easily abused. One particularly problematic aspect of this is that an oft-used convention for poverty is as a relative statistic - in other words people who are actually in real terms better able to afford food and other necessities can be handily defined as in "poverty" in a relative sense, simply because the group they are being compared to is better off.

So when someone tells you that the number of people in "poverty" has increased, remember - that doesn't mean more people are actually any worse off. It just means that there are more people in what is called "relative low income", which is a measure defined by median income.

It's considerably more sensible to an absolute figures, otherwise all you're really measuring is envy.

DavidL

Yes, I was thinking of making the same point myself.

DavidL

Farage - still pulling the some very crucial strings

Slim


Slim

Notable that Corbyn's tactics so far have been straight out of the Trump playbook - scapegoating (in this case the wealthy, natch) and repeating a lie ad nauseam in the hope that it sticks - "the NHS is for sale".

Richard_2112

And Farage has made his move. Brexit party will contest every seat unless Boris tears up his deal and negotiates another one.

Not a cat in hells chance Boris will do that so I would place bets on yet another hung parliament.
Over thinking, over analyzing separates the body from the mind. Withering my intuition, missing opportunities and I must feed my will to feel my moment drawing way outside the lines.

Slim

Yep, I think that's fair. Farage has gone for the full nuclear option. And despite what I said yesterday, he probably will be fielding a candidate against Andrew Bridgen, my own MP.

So as already observed there is no chance of Boris chucking away the deal he's arrived at with the EU. His own party would not wear it. Personally I would prefer to leave with no deal. But politics is the art of the achievable and it isn't, not at this election anyway. So there's a danger that the pro-democratic vote will be split. The Brexit Party might pick up a few seats but not a lot.  Hartlepool and a couple of others maybe.

pxr5

I read this the other day and thought it apt.

Does socialism work? A classroom experiment.

http://www.thecommentator.com/article/646/does_socialism_work_a_classroom_experiment

An economics professor at a local college made a statement that he had never failed a single student before, but had recently failed an entire class. That class had insisted that Obama's socialism worked and that no one would be poor and no one would be rich; a great equalizer.

The professor then said, "OK, we will have an experiment in this class on Obama's plan". All grades will be averaged and everyone will receive the same grade so no one will fail and no one will receive an A (substituting grades for dollars - something closer to home and more readily understood by all).

After the first test, the grades were averaged and everyone got a B. The students who studied hard were upset and the students who studied little were happy.

As the second test rolled around, the students who studied little had studied even less and the ones who studied hard decided they wanted a free ride too so they studied little.

The second test average was a D! No one was happy.

When the third test rolled around, the average was an F.

As the tests proceeded, the scores never increased as bickering, blame and name-calling all resulted in hard feelings and no one would study for the benefit of anyone else.

To their great surprise, all failed and the professor told them that socialism would also ultimately fail because when the reward is great, the effort to succeed is great, but when government takes all the reward away, no one will try or want to succeed.

It could not be any simpler than that.

zoony

A conservative majority would see us leave the EU, that isn't under question, but unfortunately it isn't a proper Brexit, and they know that. Probably the lesser of 2 evils though, because Labour and the liberals just don't want any kind of Brexit.