Brexit watch

Started by Nick, October 20, 2016, 17:02:39 pm

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Slim

Quote from: NeilP on March 05, 2017, 10:38:45 am
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-39151755


Fair's fair, Hilary Benn actually expresses a bit of concern for British people as well as immigrants, as quoted in that piece. Surprising for a Labour politician, but credit where it's due.

döm

Quote from: Slim on March 05, 2017, 20:15:24 pm
Fair's fair, Hilary Benn actually expresses a bit of concern for British people as well as immigrants, as quoted in that piece. Surprising for a Labour politician, but credit where it's due.



That raises an interesting question, I think.  Who should a UK politician have more concern for. Someone born abroad now living and working in the UK or the reverse. I think the former. Someone currently contributing to the economy and society deserves more attention than someone who does the reverse.  So Hilary don't concern yourself with me, save your concern for an Irish born national currently living in the UK.
You can check out any time you like but you can never leave!

Slim

Quote from: döm on March 05, 2017, 20:50:03 pmThat raises an interesting question, I think.  Who should a UK politician have more concern for. Someone born abroad now living and working in the UK or the reverse. I think the former.


I think citizenship is the critical factor. Government has a considerably greater responsibility to its own citizens, irrespective of their present location, than it has to the citizens of other countries resident in the UK.

Matt2112

He's sound is our Hilary.  Corbyn sacked him from the Shadow Cabinet, which of course proves it.
The keys to happiness

NeilP


Matt2112

He's a great man is RD, with whom I almost never disagree.

On this however, it's just the same old familiar moot argument, and while there may be the odd fair point, it's generally mere post hoc hand-wringing over what's gone.

We need astute commentary on the way forward, not pointless complaining.
The keys to happiness

NeilP


DavidL

March 10, 2017, 11:20:51 am #727 Last Edit: March 10, 2017, 11:37:35 am by DavidL
Quote from: Matt2112 on March 10, 2017, 08:06:13 am
He's a great man is RD, with whom I almost never disagree.

On this however, it's just the same old familiar moot argument, and while there may be the odd fair point, it's generally mere post hoc hand-wringing over what's gone.

We need astute commentary on the way forward, not pointless complaining.
Contradicts himself in the first minute. Another sore loser who likes to call everyone who disagrees with him ignorant. Also puts great store in those with a PHD in economics - not that clever then are you, Richard? He's right about one thing, the arrogance of Cameron.
The British people have spoken....you just didn't like what they had to say.

Matt2112

Quote from: DavidL on March 10, 2017, 11:20:51 am
Contradicts himself in the first minute. Another sore loser who likes to call everyone who disagrees with him ignorant. Also puts great store in those with a PHD in economics - not that clever then are you, Richard? He's right about one thing, the arrogance of Cameron.
The British people have spoken....you just didn't like what they had to say.



Yes, I'd expect much better from someone who is a master of popularising science, critical thinking and eloquent expression; his normally rigorous standards have slipped on this one.
The keys to happiness

döm

I thought he spoke a lot of sense - question of perspective I suppose !
You can check out any time you like but you can never leave!

NeilP

it seemed a coherent argument to me, suggesting DC was at fault for not insisting on the 'what if' scenario with a significant majority etc - mostly due to his fear of UKiP

DavidL

Quote from: NeilP on March 10, 2017, 12:31:06 pm
it seemed a coherent argument to me, suggesting DC was at fault for not insisting on the 'what if' scenario with a significant majority etc - mostly due to his fear of UKiP
To have insisted on a 'significant'  majority would have engendered even more mistrust of the political class. Cameron wanted to be seen as an 'honest broker' in the selling of the referendum to the British people. He was done up like a KIPper! Out of touch and arrogant - typical of many of his ilk. Of course Dawkins only argues the case now as he believes it would have preserved the status quo of which he is so fond - crying over spilt milk.
Milton Friedman's "beware the tyranny of the status quo", never seemed so apt.

Matt2112

RD's argument in this case is pretty coherent in and of itself, it's just moot, retrospective and doesn't add anything.  He's a far better mind than this.

We are where we are - let's light some candles rather than curse the darkness.
The keys to happiness

NeilP

Quote from: DavidL on March 10, 2017, 13:27:13 pm
To have insisted on a 'significant'  majority would have engendered even more mistrust of the political class. Cameron wanted to be seen as an 'honest broker' in the selling of the referendum to the British people. He was done up like a KIPper! Out of touch and arrogant - typical of many of his ilk. Of course Dawkins only argues the case now as he believes it would have preserved the status quo of which he is so fond - crying over spilt milk.
Milton Friedman's "beware the tyranny of the status quo", never seemed so apt.



Well he was saying this last year in fairness


http://www.prospectmagazine.co.uk/magazine/eu-referendum-richard-dawkins-brexit-23rd-june-ignoramuses

NeilP