Brexit watch

Started by Nick, October 20, 2016, 17:02:39 pm

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NeilP


DavidL


NeilP

Theresa May is utterly clear that the Brexit vote was about immigration- "controlling our borders", above free trade.While she busies herself setting fire to our access to the world's largest free market in order to control EU immigration to Britain, non-EU immigration to Britain outstripped EU immigration in 2016. There's no sign she is taking such drastic action to control immigration from other parts of the world. Maybe they'll pick sprouts for less money in the new leaner, fitter labour market?

Richard_2112

Quote from: NeilP on January 19, 2017, 00:12:44 am
Theresa May is utterly clear that the Brexit vote was about immigration- "controlling our borders", above free trade.While she busies herself setting fire to our access to the world's largest free market in order to control EU immigration to Britain, non-EU immigration to Britain outstripped EU immigration in 2016. There's no sign she is taking such drastic action to control immigration from other parts of the world. Maybe they'll pick sprouts for less money in the new leaner, fitter labour market?

This is the one that always baffles me about May, and why people think she's a safe pair of hands. Wasn't it her job as Home Secretary to bring those non-EU immigration figures down? Failed pretty spectacularly there I'd say, and now she's going to send those pesky immigrants back, yeah right...
Over thinking, over analyzing separates the body from the mind. Withering my intuition, missing opportunities and I must feed my will to feel my moment drawing way outside the lines.

DavidL

Quote from: Richard_2112 on January 19, 2017, 01:20:23 am
This is the one that always baffles me about May, and why people think she's a safe pair of hands. Wasn't it her job as Home Secretary to bring those non-EU immigration figures down? Failed pretty spectacularly there I'd say, and now she's going to send those pesky immigrants back, yeah right...
Exactly right. She talked tough as Home Secretary but achieved little. My theory is that the department purposefully kept non-EU immigration high(er) in an attempt to deflect the criticism away from the free-movement issue (I think it worked,to a point, your comment is evidence of that). Very cynical politics by a pro-remain government department, if that was the case.
I don't believe any immigrants that came legally will be 'sent back'.

DavidL

Quote from: NeilP on January 19, 2017, 00:12:44 am
Theresa May is utterly clear that the Brexit vote was about immigration- "controlling our borders", above free trade.While she busies herself setting fire to our access to the world's largest free market in order to control EU immigration to Britain, non-EU immigration to Britain outstripped EU immigration in 2016. There's no sign she is taking such drastic action to control immigration from other parts of the world. Maybe they'll pick sprouts for less money in the new leaner, fitter labour market?
She, rightfully, acknowledges that controlling immigration was one of the most important issue for many. Like it, or not, most people are not supportive of a system that allows any EU citizen to come to the UK, possibly without chance of employment, to contribute to additional pressure on infrastructure, services, education and housing. Obviously she hopes that access to the single market can be retained but, if not, new trading opportunities can compensate. Undoubtedly this is a massive gamble.
Removing the unfairness of discriminating against non-EU immigrants appears to be a more ethical approach to accommodating those that want to settle in the UK.

NeilP

"Which country in the world is going to enter into a trade agreement with this country on the basis that the rules are entirely what the British say they're going to be, on any particular day, and if there's any dispute about the rules it's going to be sorted out by the British Government?"

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-latest-news-ken-clarker-tory-rebel-former-chancellor-conservative-eu-deal-negotiations-a7531801.html?utm_content=buffer62810&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=buffer

DavidL

Quote from: NeilP on January 19, 2017, 10:31:04 am
"Which country in the world is going to enter into a trade agreement with this country on the basis that the rules are entirely what the British say they're going to be, on any particular day, and if there's any dispute about the rules it's going to be sorted out by the British Government?"

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-latest-news-ken-clarker-tory-rebel-former-chancellor-conservative-eu-deal-negotiations-a7531801.html?utm_content=buffer62810&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=buffer
If ever there was an intervention that shows what a terribly sore, old loser Ken is. We are leaving the EU and his twilight years have been destroyed - shame.

Slim

Quote from: NeilP on January 19, 2017, 00:12:44 am
Theresa May is utterly clear that the Brexit vote was about immigration- "controlling our borders", above free trade.While she busies herself setting fire to our access to the world's largest free market in order to control EU immigration to Britain


The referendum voters have done that. There's no sense in criticising the current government for following through on its promise to deliver on the referendum result.


NeilP

Since 2004, European law has allowed governments to control movements of EU citizens as follows; allow EU citizens to freely circulate for only three months and then require them (should they wish to stay longer) to show they are working (either employed of self employed), a registered student, or have sufficient resources (either pension or savings) to support themselves and comprehensive medical insurance. The UK is one of the few governments not to have implemented this.

For six years TM was in charge of the home office responsible for these regulations pertaining to immigration and failed to implement them.

Make your own mind up about quite May failed to do so and why the Brexit crew constantly lied about there being "uncontrolled immigration" when it was solely due to a conscious action by May herself not to limit it within the laws provided by the EU.

The answer is of course, these people were allowed in to drive down indigenous wages and provide the whinging right wing of the party with a stick to beat the EU.

döm

Wilful neglect from the sounds of it.  Shame the remain camp didn't make more of it when it mattered.
You can check out any time you like but you can never leave!

Nïckslïkk2112

Quote from: NeilP on January 19, 2017, 16:44:51 pm
The answer is of course, these people were allowed in to drive down indigenous wages and provide the whinging right wing of the party with a stick to beat the EU.

What absolute Tommy Rot. The whinging right of the Conservative party don't need any reason to find a stick to beat the EU.

We should have stuck to the Churchillian principle of "With Europe, not part of Europe". We'll always be there for European trade and to help out if necessary when various subsets of Europeans get a bit fractious and uppity, but Britain has a long history of looking out to the world, indeed Britain ahs a long history of being Britain whereas lots of these European states are relatively recent constructs and could more easily be moulded into a new state.
Legend in my own Mind


DavidL

Quote from: NeilP on January 19, 2017, 16:44:51 pm
Since 2004, European law has allowed governments to control movements of EU citizens as follows; allow EU citizens to freely circulate for only three months and then require them (should they wish to stay longer) to show they are working (either employed of self employed), a registered student, or have sufficient resources (either pension or savings) to support themselves and comprehensive medical insurance. The UK is one of the few governments not to have implemented this.

For six years TM was in charge of the home office responsible for these regulations pertaining to immigration and failed to implement them.

Make your own mind up about quite May failed to do so and why the Brexit crew constantly lied about there being "uncontrolled immigration" when it was solely due to a conscious action by May herself not to limit it within the laws provided by the EU.

The answer is of course, these people were allowed in to drive down indigenous wages and provide the whinging right wing of the party with a stick to beat the EU.
But would implementation of this process have made much difference? The majority of EU migrants are in (low paid) work. The fact is that big business has become addicted to cheap labour (along with the government).
I don't see why May, (supposedly) a Remainer, would try to placate the Eurosceptics within her party, as you suggest. The idea that the Home Office could implement such checks is laughable - due to lack of resources and incompetence. Just as laughable is the notion that any other EU country tracks immigrants in this way.