Manchester

[Bez]

I am off to see Maiden at the 02 Saturday - slightly more on edge and wary than usual but determined to have a good time. Hope you both do too at Kiss.

Looking forward to standing next to (slightly behind) you, mate....

I'm apprehensive as well, but I'll be there, right enough....

[The Letter R]

Indeed Paul - yes slightly behind me though please...

[DavidL]

Do you have to turn every post into some kind of political opinion piece?

I'm guessing that's rhetorical. If not, the answer is no. However, if it is relevant to the thread, my post may contain one or more references to politics. I make no apologies for that.

[NeilP]

https://twitter.com/johnpilger/status/870048020041281537

[DavidL]

https://twitter.com/johnpilger/status/870048020041281537

That's an interesting piece, although it doesn't make clear that jihadism existed before the interventions mentioned. Agree that the actions of various western governments have exacerbated the situation but these people require no excuse for their barbarity.
However, red or blue, makes no difference. We are ruled by misguided idiots. Wouldn't surprise me if Blair and Cameron often take mutual solace in late night phone calls, they must both struggle to sleep at times.

[Matt2112]

That's an interesting piece, although it doesn't make clear that jihadism existed before the interventions mentioned. Agree that the actions of various western governments have exacerbated the situation but these people require no excuse for their barbarity. However, red or blue, makes no difference.

Precisely.  Pilger often argues coherently to a point, but habitually begs crucial questions than simply don't seem to occur to him.  He'd be a formidable advocate of true progressivism if not for these sort of baffling blind spots.

[DavidL]

Good to see Maajid Nawaz talking complete sense on breakfast TV this morning. His honesty in admitting that hate preachers are widespread and in calling the home-grown jihadism issue an 'insurgency' is part of finding a solution.
In my view, defence of liberal values and cultural sensitivity should not trump the prevention of innocent citizens being blown to bits. We've become a laughing stock among the extremists - one of the 'London three' was the star of his own TV show ffs! 

[Matt2112]

Good to see Maajid Nawaz talking complete sense on breakfast TV this morning. His honesty in admitting that hate preachers are widespread and in calling the home-grown jihadism issue an 'insurgency' is part of finding a solution.
In my view, defence of liberal values and cultural sensitivity should not trump the prevention of innocent citizens being blown to bits. We've become a laughing stock among the extremists - one of the 'London three' was the star of his own TV show ffs! 

Maajid Nawaz - and the Quilliam Foundation of which he's a founder - has been one of the few sane, sensible and honest voices about this whole issue for a long time.


It's always gratifying when regressive left apologists of any religion and indeed none can't and/or won't acknowledge the elephant in the room, only for their arguments to be annihilated by someone - a former Islamist extremist indeed - who is far more theologically, politically and philosophically literate than they will ever be. 

[DavidL]

Maajid Nawaz - and the Quilliam Foundation of which he's a founder - has been one of the few sane, sensible and honest voices about this whole issue for a long time.


It's always gratifying when regressive left apologists of any religion and indeed none can't and/or won't acknowledge the elephant in the room, only for their arguments to be annihilated by someone - a former Islamist extremist indeed - who is far more theologically, politically and philosophically literate than they will ever be.

Indeed. Much like the immigration debate, honesty has been in short supply around this issue.

[DavidL]

So the last of the 'London three' to be named was prevented from travelling to Syria to fight and 'red-flagged' by the Italian authorities and yet he was let into the UK, probably with a cordial smile and a welcoming comment by our, ahem.....'Border Force' - farcical.

[Richard_2112]

So the last of the 'London three' to be named was prevented from travelling to Syria to fight and 'red-flagged' by the Italian authorities and yet he was let into the UK, probably with a cordial smile and a welcoming comment by our, ahem.....'Border Force' - farcical.

Whoever was Home Secretary should resign in shame for doing such a poor job...

[zoony]

Whoever was Home Secretary should resign in shame for doing such a poor job...

Agreed mate.

[NeilP]

So the last of the 'London three' to be named was prevented from travelling to Syria to fight and 'red-flagged' by the Italian authorities and yet he was let into the UK, probably with a cordial smile and a welcoming comment by our, ahem.....'Border Force' - farcical.

well the Manchester monster was likely encouraged to travel to Libya to depose of Gaddafi in 2011 via SIS so the UK Govt seems far from innocent when he later became radicalised and joined his disillusioned brethren bringing such sorrow to so many British families affected by the events at the MEN... sad times indeed


http://www.aljazeera.com/indepth/opinion/2017/05/libya-manchester-connection-170528081044095.html

[Matt2112]

Whoever was Home Secretary should resign in shame for doing such a poor job...

It will look like it was a tenure of astute political genius if Abbott fills the position after Thursday.


Add Shami Chakrabarti as Attorney General and the prospect of a Labour victory just doesn't bear thinking about.

[DavidL]

Whoever was Home Secretary should resign in shame for doing such a poor job...

I've always been critical of her record as Home Secretary but it has to be considered in the context of a world that is dominated by politicians with  liberal values.